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	<title>Comments on: On the Waterfront</title>
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	<link>http://eyeofthefish.org/on-the-waterfront/</link>
	<description>A wide-angle view of architecture, urban design and life in Wellington</description>
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		<title>By: Maximus</title>
		<link>http://eyeofthefish.org/on-the-waterfront/#comment-9051</link>
		<dc:creator>Maximus</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 16 Jun 2009 19:50:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://eyeofthefish.org/?p=736#comment-9051</guid>
		<description>and this one also - both from 19 May 2009

&quot;Entities failed in their duty&quot;

&quot;I was appalled to read your article about Wellington&#039;s rotting wharf piles and the potential demand on ratepayers to meet the multimillion-dollar cost of repairs. What&#039;s even worse is that the council knew nine years ago that urgent repairs were required.
Yet, at the flick of a pen, it has committed many millions to the proposed Kilbirnie sports centre project. Though I don&#039;t oppose the project per se, I&#039;ve always questioned the wisdom of committing this sum toward a loss-making facility in these difficult economic times, but not putting money toward the wharves&#039; repiling.
The council and the waterfront company seem to have been loath to allocate funding over the past decade, hoping a fairy godmother would come along to buy up the wharf properties and that she would do the repairs as part of the package.
It&#039;s astonishing that the council and related waterfront company seem to have failed in their duty to maintain the unsafe wharves&#039; structures in question.
No worry, just sock the ratepayers an extra few hundred each each year to cover the repairs. We&#039;re all swimming in surplus money.
VRYN EVANS
Newlands [abridged]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>and this one also &#8211; both from 19 May 2009</p>
<p>&#8220;Entities failed in their duty&#8221;</p>
<p>&#8220;I was appalled to read your article about Wellington&#8217;s rotting wharf piles and the potential demand on ratepayers to meet the multimillion-dollar cost of repairs. What&#8217;s even worse is that the council knew nine years ago that urgent repairs were required.<br />
Yet, at the flick of a pen, it has committed many millions to the proposed Kilbirnie sports centre project. Though I don&#8217;t oppose the project per se, I&#8217;ve always questioned the wisdom of committing this sum toward a loss-making facility in these difficult economic times, but not putting money toward the wharves&#8217; repiling.<br />
The council and the waterfront company seem to have been loath to allocate funding over the past decade, hoping a fairy godmother would come along to buy up the wharf properties and that she would do the repairs as part of the package.<br />
It&#8217;s astonishing that the council and related waterfront company seem to have failed in their duty to maintain the unsafe wharves&#8217; structures in question.<br />
No worry, just sock the ratepayers an extra few hundred each each year to cover the repairs. We&#8217;re all swimming in surplus money.<br />
VRYN EVANS<br />
Newlands [abridged]</p>
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		<title>By: Maximus</title>
		<link>http://eyeofthefish.org/on-the-waterfront/#comment-9050</link>
		<dc:creator>Maximus</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 16 Jun 2009 19:48:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://eyeofthefish.org/?p=736#comment-9050</guid>
		<description>Just thought I&#039;d post this letter to the DomPost, as they seem to get rid of letters after a while.
&quot;Logic is hard to understand&quot;
&quot;The news that Wellington&#039;s crumbling wharves will cost tens of millions of dollars to fix came as a storm from the northwest battered the waterfront. Bits of the wharf have been washing up on Oriental Bay and other beaches around the city for years, so it&#039;s difficult to understand why Wellington City Council has not acted on this.
It&#039;s also hard to understand the logic advanced by mayor Kerry Prendergast and others that any fixing or maintenance of the piles can be done only if accompanied by the construction of more buildings on the waterfront.
Recently, a girl fell off her bicycle into the harbour as she attempted to navigate a particularly narrow section of the waterfront. Continuing to build on an already overloaded structure doesn&#039;t seem as wise an option as better maintenance and management.&quot;
MARY WAREHAM
Oriental Bay</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Just thought I&#8217;d post this letter to the DomPost, as they seem to get rid of letters after a while.<br />
&#8220;Logic is hard to understand&#8221;<br />
&#8220;The news that Wellington&#8217;s crumbling wharves will cost tens of millions of dollars to fix came as a storm from the northwest battered the waterfront. Bits of the wharf have been washing up on Oriental Bay and other beaches around the city for years, so it&#8217;s difficult to understand why Wellington City Council has not acted on this.<br />
It&#8217;s also hard to understand the logic advanced by mayor Kerry Prendergast and others that any fixing or maintenance of the piles can be done only if accompanied by the construction of more buildings on the waterfront.<br />
Recently, a girl fell off her bicycle into the harbour as she attempted to navigate a particularly narrow section of the waterfront. Continuing to build on an already overloaded structure doesn&#8217;t seem as wise an option as better maintenance and management.&#8221;<br />
MARY WAREHAM<br />
Oriental Bay</p>
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		<title>By: Wharfie</title>
		<link>http://eyeofthefish.org/on-the-waterfront/#comment-8594</link>
		<dc:creator>Wharfie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 25 May 2009 21:54:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://eyeofthefish.org/?p=736#comment-8594</guid>
		<description></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>On what sort of professional basis can one make a comment such as &#8220;There is no heritage value. They’re a bunch of old wharves ffs. They look like crap and serve no function.&#8221;?</p>
<p>Look, I&#8217;m hardly what you&#8217;d call a heritage fundamentalist, and can often see that there are times when old buildings might have to make way for good new buildings that fit current and future needs. But I can also see that visible connections to history are very important, and heritage values go far beyond just recognising the twiddly details on pretty old buildings: the ICOMOS charter recognises aesthetic, historic, scientific and social value. We&#8217;ve tended to neglect our industrial and infrastructural heritage: just because something is &#8220;functional&#8221; doesn&#8217;t mean it is valueless, and just because your own memory only goes back as far as indoor netball it doesn&#8217;t mean that the connections to immigration, maritime commerce and wartime deployments aren&#8217;t significant and worth considering.</p>
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		<title>By: Honeywood</title>
		<link>http://eyeofthefish.org/on-the-waterfront/#comment-8575</link>
		<dc:creator>Honeywood</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 25 May 2009 02:34:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://eyeofthefish.org/?p=736#comment-8575</guid>
		<description>davidp you need to be careful mentioning the tugboat restaurant.  I once made a passing comment about it in an article I wrote on Oriental Bay and theowner rang me up and threatened me with the bash...

I find it curious that wharves that were built for entirely functional reasons are protected 150 years for aesthetic or heritage reasons.  Wellington&#039;s wharves grew to meet the growing needs of the marine traffic and now that we have very little such traffic, we become obsessed about whether to repair them in timber or concrete.  If they have little sentimental value (particularly the outer T which for the majority can only bring memories of indoor netball or a helicopter ride they once took) and less historical value (exactly what did tie up here and who can remember it?) pull it down, change it, develop it and make it a vital part of the waterfront.  Instead of trying to find a commerciall use that &quot;fits&quot; the outer T we should be investigating the shape of a new wharf that would give the best commercial return balanced with the best public use.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>davidp you need to be careful mentioning the tugboat restaurant.  I once made a passing comment about it in an article I wrote on Oriental Bay and theowner rang me up and threatened me with the bash&#8230;</p>
<p>I find it curious that wharves that were built for entirely functional reasons are protected 150 years for aesthetic or heritage reasons.  Wellington&#8217;s wharves grew to meet the growing needs of the marine traffic and now that we have very little such traffic, we become obsessed about whether to repair them in timber or concrete.  If they have little sentimental value (particularly the outer T which for the majority can only bring memories of indoor netball or a helicopter ride they once took) and less historical value (exactly what did tie up here and who can remember it?) pull it down, change it, develop it and make it a vital part of the waterfront.  Instead of trying to find a commerciall use that &#8220;fits&#8221; the outer T we should be investigating the shape of a new wharf that would give the best commercial return balanced with the best public use.</p>
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		<title>By: davidp</title>
		<link>http://eyeofthefish.org/on-the-waterfront/#comment-8556</link>
		<dc:creator>davidp</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 24 May 2009 05:05:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://eyeofthefish.org/?p=736#comment-8556</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t see why decaying piles stuck in water have any conservation value. I&#039;d have no problem with the whole wharf (and the one the Police have recently vacated) being demolished and rebuilt.

In which case, why shouldn&#039;t we build new &quot;wharves&quot; (ie. piled structures jutting out in to the harbour on which structures could be built)?  The water would have to be sufficiently shallow. Sinking the ugly and bizarre tugboat restaurant and replacing it with a building pushing out in to the harbour would be a vast improvement, IMHO.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t see why decaying piles stuck in water have any conservation value. I&#8217;d have no problem with the whole wharf (and the one the Police have recently vacated) being demolished and rebuilt.</p>
<p>In which case, why shouldn&#8217;t we build new &#8220;wharves&#8221; (ie. piled structures jutting out in to the harbour on which structures could be built)?  The water would have to be sufficiently shallow. Sinking the ugly and bizarre tugboat restaurant and replacing it with a building pushing out in to the harbour would be a vast improvement, IMHO.</p>
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		<title>By: Rondo</title>
		<link>http://eyeofthefish.org/on-the-waterfront/#comment-8525</link>
		<dc:creator>Rondo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 23 May 2009 03:14:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://eyeofthefish.org/?p=736#comment-8525</guid>
		<description>Well there certainly won&#039;t be an heritage if they replace as the rotting timber with new concrete piles. So if the exact materials of the wharf don&#039;t matter, (like the apocryphal Grandfathers axe) then what are we worrying about? 

Knock it down and start again   fix the ridiculous traffic problem with cars and taxis still pissing us all off.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well there certainly won&#8217;t be an heritage if they replace as the rotting timber with new concrete piles. So if the exact materials of the wharf don&#8217;t matter, (like the apocryphal Grandfathers axe) then what are we worrying about? </p>
<p>Knock it down and start again   fix the ridiculous traffic problem with cars and taxis still pissing us all off.</p>
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		<title>By: Rimu</title>
		<link>http://eyeofthefish.org/on-the-waterfront/#comment-8492</link>
		<dc:creator>Rimu</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 22 May 2009 07:01:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://eyeofthefish.org/?p=736#comment-8492</guid>
		<description>There is no heritage value. They&#039;re a bunch of old  wharves ffs. They look like crap and serve no function.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There is no heritage value. They&#8217;re a bunch of old  wharves ffs. They look like crap and serve no function.</p>
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		<title>By: Alan</title>
		<link>http://eyeofthefish.org/on-the-waterfront/#comment-8489</link>
		<dc:creator>Alan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 22 May 2009 04:57:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://eyeofthefish.org/?p=736#comment-8489</guid>
		<description>Yes but where is the financial imperative in that ?  There&#039;s a lot of cost but not much return. The wharf needs an ongoing source of income.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes but where is the financial imperative in that ?  There&#8217;s a lot of cost but not much return. The wharf needs an ongoing source of income.</p>
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		<title>By: Maximus</title>
		<link>http://eyeofthefish.org/on-the-waterfront/#comment-8488</link>
		<dc:creator>Maximus</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 22 May 2009 04:19:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://eyeofthefish.org/?p=736#comment-8488</guid>
		<description>Pull them down and start again? Provocative to be sure, but perhaps that really is the only thing to do. Look: we all know that where they currently tie the international cruise ships is a shameful tip, that you wouldn&#039;t send a shipment of live sheep to, let alone a rich boat full of Americans. Surely the Outer T is the only place we really want the Cruise ships to be. 

That means the outer T will need to be rebuilt. Longer, stronger, better. We can rebuild it. We have the technology. We have the expertise.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Pull them down and start again? Provocative to be sure, but perhaps that really is the only thing to do. Look: we all know that where they currently tie the international cruise ships is a shameful tip, that you wouldn&#8217;t send a shipment of live sheep to, let alone a rich boat full of Americans. Surely the Outer T is the only place we really want the Cruise ships to be. </p>
<p>That means the outer T will need to be rebuilt. Longer, stronger, better. We can rebuild it. We have the technology. We have the expertise.</p>
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		<title>By: thomas</title>
		<link>http://eyeofthefish.org/on-the-waterfront/#comment-8483</link>
		<dc:creator>thomas</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 May 2009 23:02:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://eyeofthefish.org/?p=736#comment-8483</guid>
		<description>According to this week&#039;s &quot;Wellingtonian&quot;, wharf restoration means encasing the rotting piles in concrete jackets - which to me makes any &#039;heritage value&#039; argument seem pretty farcical...

The article goes on to suggest that restoration (ala jackets) will only set us back $5.3million ($3.5million of which needs to be spent on the project rather urgently). Of course, if a decent structure is to be built on any of the wharves, then these figures would be substantially higher - I wonder if Kerry&#039;s alarmism was &#039;inspired&#039; by the costings for the proposed &#039;Hilton wharf&#039; strengthening rather than the much smaller costs of refurbishing the wharves to carry their current loads...?

My original point still stands - with respect to wharves for new developments at least - building exciting new ones that actually match the exciting new buildings that they will in effect be part of will actually be more cost effective - and will have little effect on heritage values (unless you consider the preservation of the timber members - encased in concrete - as a suitable strategy for preserving heritage).

Anyway, for those heritagists among us, what can be of more heritage value than letting them rot and fall into the harbour at various rates of decay? - it will be beautifully picturesque at least...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>According to this week&#8217;s &#8220;Wellingtonian&#8221;, wharf restoration means encasing the rotting piles in concrete jackets &#8211; which to me makes any &#8216;heritage value&#8217; argument seem pretty farcical&#8230;</p>
<p>The article goes on to suggest that restoration (ala jackets) will only set us back $5.3million ($3.5million of which needs to be spent on the project rather urgently). Of course, if a decent structure is to be built on any of the wharves, then these figures would be substantially higher &#8211; I wonder if Kerry&#8217;s alarmism was &#8216;inspired&#8217; by the costings for the proposed &#8216;Hilton wharf&#8217; strengthening rather than the much smaller costs of refurbishing the wharves to carry their current loads&#8230;?</p>
<p>My original point still stands &#8211; with respect to wharves for new developments at least &#8211; building exciting new ones that actually match the exciting new buildings that they will in effect be part of will actually be more cost effective &#8211; and will have little effect on heritage values (unless you consider the preservation of the timber members &#8211; encased in concrete &#8211; as a suitable strategy for preserving heritage).</p>
<p>Anyway, for those heritagists among us, what can be of more heritage value than letting them rot and fall into the harbour at various rates of decay? &#8211; it will be beautifully picturesque at least&#8230;</p>
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